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Thoughts on natural remedies
I AM NOT tring to keep an old thread going with this post. What really bugs me is that this topic can’t be discussed in a civilized manner the way others are. I spent a hour typing only to find the thread locked and i could not post. So here it is in hopes that things turn out different. October 18 2007 I am heading out the door for about a 5.5 hour drive for pre-op tomorrow. I just have to make a comment on this post before i leave. First i would like to say that i really beleive that our bodies have the ability to prevent and/or cure cancer. I also think that it COULD BE what we put in it that breaks our bodies down and allows cancer to grow.(Why do babies get it?) I don’t know!!. What i do know for sure is we still have the same old treatments for the last 50 years which are chemo,radiation, and surgery. I beleive there is something(natural) out there that can stop this stuff.Chemo + Surgery,Chemo + Rad,Etc. What about carrot juice + Whatever?? How will we ever know if we don’t experiment. I work for one of the biggest drug companies in the world and all the sales reps they send to doctors offices are beautiful model type people (wonder why??) MONEY is why. I beleive that the reason natural remedies are not investigated more is because of money. If someone ever does discover that something simple and natural prevents or stops cancer from growing there will be a lot of stocks drop. Leaving here today i still wonder if i am doing the right thing?? I think what if?? I would like to write more but guess i should get off here. Sure glad the wife doesn’t have a cattle prod. Sorry Zach guess i read to much.LOL
Age 45 * Electrician * Wife Patty 43 * Son Danny 23 *
Muscle Invasive High Grade28 Replies-
Thank you very much, Warren.
It becomes easier for me to understand the importance of support and validation when I become the one who needs it.
I appreciate it very much.
Your BC friend,
Rosemary
Rosemary
Age – 55
T1 G3 – Tumor free 2 yrs 3 months
Dx January 2006
[quote author=Rosemary link=topic=1280.msg9174#msg9174 date=1192979796]
I know that there are people on this board who do not like me to talk about my ongoing problems stemming from my conventional cancer treatments (BCG’s), but, sometimes, I just need my turn….please[/quote]
We don’t want you to have problems to talk about… but when you do, you have as much right to qvetch as anyone else, and a right to a sympathetic ear. So don’t go keeping your troubles to yourself to protect anyone else here because the answers you get when you complain can help someone else just like you help everyone.
-Warren
TaG3 + CIS 12/2000. TURB + Mitomycin C (No BCG)
Urethral stricture, urethroplasty 10/2009
CIS 11/2010 treated with BCG. CIS 5/2012 treated with BCG/interferon
T1G3 1/2013. Radical Cystectomy 3/5/2013, No invasive cancer. CIS in right ureter.
Incontinent. AUS implant 2/2014. AUS explant 5/2014
Pediatrician
AMEN, Wendy!
;)
Age 45 * Electrician * Wife Patty 43 * Son Danny 23 *
Muscle Invasive High Grade
Thank you Patricia……I am ordering as we speak! ;D
Age 45 * Electrician * Wife Patty 43 * Son Danny 23 *
Muscle Invasive High Grade
[quote author=Wayne link=topic=1280.msg9179#msg9179 date=1192988019]
Hi WendyYes,I am schedule for surgery tomorrow morning if i don’t chicken out. If i did chicken out it would not be because of some miracle cure i am chasing. It would be because i am chicken. >>>><>>>>>We need to be able to discuss all avenues with BC because (WHO KNOWS).
[/quote]My dear Wayne…you’re going tomorrow for the cystectomy surgery? I didn’t realise!
I know for a fact you are not going to chicken out; you wouldn’t be here posting to us if that was the case.
I will be thinking about you and your wife tomorrow. You’ll have plenty of time to become an expert in healthy living during and after your recovery.
When you wake up, the worst will be over. Then the fun starts. Meaning: the rest of your life.
Wendy
Hi Wendy
Yes,I am schedule for surgery tomorrow morning if i don’t chicken out. If i did chicken out it would not be because of some miracle cure i am chasing. It would be because i am chicken. I bet even after i have this surgery when i discuss something other than chemo,Rad,or surgery someone will have comments such as we read. I breeze through those rather quickly not much sinks in. I am tring to change the way i eat because i need to. I use to eat and drink stuff with lots of sugar. I drank lots of coffee loaded with sugar,candy bars,etc. Now i am snacking on carrots instead of potato chips,drinking lots more water instead of sodas and i can tell a big difference in my body. I am an Electrician and was woking an average of 10 hours a day when diagnosed with BC and really thought i was doing pretty good.Thought i felt good. After changing my diet i realize i really felt awful but did not realize it. And yes we all know chemo,rad,and surgery is what we have for now and yes these are our best chance for cure. We need to be able to discuss all avenues with BC because (WHO KNOWS).
Age 45 * Electrician * Wife Patty 43 * Son Danny 23 *
Muscle Invasive High Grade
A little story about pomegranites and good intentions..
I know that there are people on this board who do not like me to talk about my ongoing problems stemming from my conventional cancer treatments (BCG’s), but, sometimes, I just need my turn….please remember that I am the fluke and not the standard and I don’t mean to frighten anyone over treatments, I would do the treatments again if I had to do it over…
The latest locale of yeast overgrowth in my body has been in my throat. Yesterday, when celebrating my Mother’s birthday, I drank the rest of her Pomegranite/Strawberry Juice drink, thinking I was giving a little boost to the fight against Cancer…
by the time I got in the car, my throat was itching so bad, I thought I would not make it fast enough to the Nystatin that was on the shelf at home.
SUGAR…..
I guess I have a little steam to let off, thanks you guys for listening, I guess I need it this morning…
Love yas
Rosemary
Rosemary
Age – 55
T1 G3 – Tumor free 2 yrs 3 months
Dx January 2006
It’s really hard to get my thoughts together concerning this subject…
I have never been able to get anything to fit RIGHT in my mind concerning my impressions of my cancer or anyone else’s cancer. (Except for maybe smokers, and even then, not all smokers get cancer)….
In my teens, I became a devotee of a certain nutrition guru by the name of Adelle Davis, with me thinking, “if I follow her words, I will never get cancer.” Well, can you guess what Adelle died of at the age of 70? You got it, CANCER. She blamed her tragic illness on things she had done wrong during her college years, (though I’m not sure what they were, maybe the same things that I did???) Needless to say, this tragedy stood me up on my head.
As for myself, I have always watched closely the things that I eat and drink and breathe, probably just because of being a little obsessive/compulsive about it…at least my family always thought so….guess what? they didn’t get cancer, I did!
And then again, with all of this being said, how do I know that all of the natural type things that I have done along the way (ie: vegetarianism, high fiber, vitamins, HERBALISM)and the natural measures that I am still taking, have not been the very arms that I have needed to fight the battle as it came?
My doctor says that “YOU ARE VERY HEALTHY, EXCEPT FOR CANCER“.
Now how do you fit that into a mindset?
Perhaps I need a Blog, however, I thank you for listening…
Your friend,
Rosemary
Rosemary
Age – 55
T1 G3 – Tumor free 2 yrs 3 months
Dx January 2006
Hi again Wayne and gang,
Wayne is scheduled and going for surgery, not skipping it for alternatives. Just in case that point got lost in the shuffle somehow.
Like Zach, I no longer believe there’s any conspiracy holding back a miracle cure. I used to, but not after getting to know just what an effort many sincere researchers are investing. True healers, not guys who are getting rich. It’s the prostate specialists making all the money, FYI.
There are ways to make ourselves a less cancer friendly environment, which is what momof4 is saying. It makes perfect sense. That’s why it’s called ‘complementary’ or “preventative” or “chemoprevention” and not ‘alternative’ unless you want to piss of your doctor. Niether my or my 2 sisters’ oncologists ordered us to make any huge changes regarding diet nor did we receive any info about diet after our diagnoses. 3 totally different cancer centers. MSK in NYC, RWJ in NJ, and The Netherlands NKI.
Actually there are many ways to make ourselves less cancer friendly environments. Dr. Lamm told me himself: “The best way to get enough and balanced vitamins is with a good diet.” He also said but nobody wants to hear that and would rather take a pill. I know I would…
Please do learn all you can about the subject. A great resource is Steve Dunn’s Cancerguide – http://cancerguide.org and of course the NCI’s database on complementary/alternative medicine (CAM, a part of PubMED), if you didn’t see this yet, that and some other CAM resources are listed here:
http://blcwebcafe.org/alternatives.asp (Stupid name for the page but that was 8-9 yrs ago and it’s not good to change page links)And Wayne, maybe the best shortcut is to buy Ralph Moss’ book for bladder cancer. You can see what he is about at his ‘cancer decisions’ site, it’s referenced at the above link. His reports contain the latest, scientifically backed, intelligently researched CAM options, going for about 300$ last I looked.
And have a good look at the book mentioned on the resource sidebar, “Choices in Healing”, it’s a wondeful book in many ways.
Wendy
w
As an added thought, and as not to edit my previous post:
I think we as Americans (I cannot speak for those of you that are not)We have been looking for the EASY way for the past few generations at least. I think we are finally coming to realize that there is no EASY way.
If someone walked up to any of us and said that they could cure cancer and you would not have to loose a breast, bladder, testicles, prostate, lung, liver, kidney or whatever other body part cancer had invaded. That sounds like a great deal. But as in other life lesson we all have had, we are coming to understand, (and hopefully the others will follow) that nothing (that is worth it) comes easy.
Well staying alive is worth it. So what is a breast, bladder, testicle, prostate, lung, liver,kidney whatever. They are only little parts of who we are. Yes we will be sad to see them go, yes, we will cry and mourn them. But if the choice is us or them. What is the logical choice. They cannot be here without us, but we can surely be here without them…good ridens I say. If they can get it out, cut it off, poison it do it. Don’t wait for the “MAGIC APPLE”, it may arrive for our children, and grandchildren, but it isn’t here yet.
So you better choose wisely, if you are considering natural remedies over Surgery, Radiation, or Chemo…None of those body parts are visible from a coffin, and I am sure that your loved ones won’t be crying and mourning “Oh, the poor breast, bladder,testicle,prostate, kidney, liver….”. “They will be crying, and mourning for YOU”!
Try your best to kill it, we may all not be successful, but at least try…your chances are alot better if you do.
So in closing, I am with Wendy…I am going to make a pitcher of Absolute Bloody Mary’s, and later maybe some Martini’s…But make mine Pomegrante…Just in case….LOL
Caregiver for my Wonderful Husband Angelo, who has Metastatic Bladder Cancer.Life isn’t about how to survive the storm, but how to dance in the rain.
I have been avoiding the site for a few days, but now I MUST chime in. Granted I understand everyones point that unfortunately there have been no natural remedies proven at this point. There is promise, but nothing proven to kill cancer but CHEMO, RADIATION, and SURGERY. To advocate for a natural remedy INSTEAD of PROVEN Medical Treatments is ridiculous. But in combination with medical treatments the truely NATURAL as in I can grow, pick, or find it in the produce isle remedies that have SHOWN that they can help manage or maintain a health lifestyle AFTER treatment cannot hurt. Many of these things are on the food pyramid of what should be consumed everyday anyway. This I maintain, (as I have in previous posts) is completely different than the “I CAN CURE CANCER PEDDLERS” out there that want to sell you herbal supplements for hundreds of dollars. Why not just add the REAL herbs to your diet? Isn’t that the idea of NATURAL REMEDY? There is nothing out there besides chemo, radiation, surgery, and VIGIANCE that can CURE CANCER. There are things in their NATURAL FORM, that have shown promise of avoiding cancer all together, and to boost your antioxident levels, free radical levels etc…and I am sure it is a good practice to do this AFTER surgery. But unfortunately the only thing that KILLS cancer right now is to CUT IT OUT, or poison it. THAT IS IT. Now to keep it out of our bodies after that. I believe with certain fruits/vegetables, grains etc., and avoiding the bad things, we can try to make our bodies the kind that cancer decides it can no longer thrive in and doesn’t grow. This I beleive is very possible…So in closing, I say you want an apple, banana, some cumin srinkled on your chicken, some fruit or vegetable juice, green tea, black tea, you want to rub hot peppers on tender joints, put eggs in your hair to make it shiney, eat whole grains so you stay regular…do it…But Go to the DR., and if you have cancer, let them help you hunt it down and kill it where it lies, because there isn’t an apple in town that can take on THIS beast once it ARRIVES.
Have a Great Sunday,
Karen
Caregiver for my Wonderful Husband Angelo, who has Metastatic Bladder Cancer.Life isn’t about how to survive the storm, but how to dance in the rain.
[quote author=Zachary link=topic=1280.msg9163#msg9163 date=1192944190] I’m sure when Wendy was diagnosed, she searched as hard as anyone for evidence of a natural treatment to avoid surgery. I’m glad she didn’t wait for one–I much prefer her to be here among the living.
[/quote]Thanks Zach, that was sweet and I’m glad you are among the living too, and part of this forum.
Acutally I began my search for a natural cure for my sister, when she had breast cancer in ’97; I bought and cooked only the purest food, made juices, forced her to drink water and change her bad habits, though she had never smoked or drank, unlike moi. She also had chemo, surgery and radiation and a stem cell transplant-the most toxic treatment ever dreamed up. She was dead within 15 months. Sometimes nothing works, nothing at all.
When my other sister got bladder cancer right after that, I searched hard for natural things for her cancer too…and actually there was a lot of non-toxic things being studied back in ’98 when I began that search, some of it still being investigated and some not; GLA (a fatty acid) was used instead of BCG and found to be helpful, KHL was a promising natural BCG substitute (not that BCG isn’t natural cuz it is…but in a different way),garlic, tea and lots of things have been looked into, and found to be helpful. But not helpful enough to incorporate into treatment plans.
There is nothing to prevent us from using good quality things like fish oil and curcumin and a good vitamin. Lamm’s Oncovite is for those on BCG, and his data said it helped (although, granted, it was a small trial).
I have a good article about ‘chemoprevention’-another term for natural, healthy ways to prevent cancer from happening or recurring, by Ashish Kamat from MDAnderson, if anyone wants, let me know and I can forward, it’s from the J of U, recent.
WebCafe’s “Chemoprevention” section has been tracking natural complementary approaches; however the final conclusions are always the same: More study needed.
http://blcwebcafe.org/chemoprevention.aspDrs. Lamm and Kamat have been at the forefront of investigating these non-toxic therapies for many years, both are highly respected in the field. Both studied garlic and tea, vitamins and many other things and sometimes published together. Kamat is an advisor for this site.
Maybe if a person who gets a cancer dx is depressed, that should be treated along with the cancer.
I’d seen cancer kill my father and sister, who did every treatment in vain. Actually promised myself if I ever got cancer to skip treatments and just party heartily till it was over. But when it actually happened that the lump was a tumor, my husband’s face….plus, how could I go and die, I knew it would kill my remaining 2 big sisters and my mother. So I agreed to surgery, pathology was not good, had treatments and they were tough, too. More than I bargained for – but here I is…and I truly believe that if I hadn’t started on Prozac about 2 months before my dx, I would have not gone for treatments. I had avoided medical treatments for 43 years up till that time (phobias).
Lucky for me I also have the constitution of an oxe, one of those types who never gets sick, aside from the occasional hangover (which was an occupational hazard for a blues singer :) ) and the very occasional tumor ::)
I’ve read that something like 20% of the population avoids medical treatments due to needle and other phobias, that it’s actually a large problem. At least I’m not the only wimp out there! I’m not ashamed to admit I need 20mgs of valium before any kind of procedure or needle. I’m not on anti-depressants anymore, kicking them was very hard, but I suppose the trade off was worth in the end: getting long term survival after treatment for advanced cancer.
I’m lucky, actually. Very lucky.
Take good care,
Wendy
PS I’m not bragging, but I drink a couple of vodkas at cocktail hour everyday…remembering my doctors words, “Just be happy.”
[quote author=Wayne link=topic=1280.msg9049#msg9049 date=1192728293]
I beleive there is something(natural) out there that can stop this stuff.Chemo + Surgery,Chemo + Rad,Etc. What about carrot juice + Whatever?? How will we ever know if we don’t experiment.
[/quote]If you look hard enough, you can find just about anything–including people far less scrupulous than drug companies making far more outrageous claims, all in the interest of “natural”.
This one, by the way, is, and I quote, “Unconditionally Guaranteed!” And like all good natural cures, is a “powerful herb from the Amazon Rainforest”.
http://www.healthyheartht.info/graviola.htm
My opinion is that many of these cure-peddlers absolutely do not want testing. It is far too easy for them, and far too profitable, to make unsubstantiated claims and then say, well, big drug companies are keeping us from testing and experimenting.
They are happy to make the claim “kill cancer cells” (like the above product does) without the expenses of actually proving it and the consequences of whether it does what they say it will. You know what? I’ll bet it may kill cancer cells. Bleach kills cancer cells. Many things kill cancer cells. Is this an effective and life-prolonging treatment and surgical alternative? That is the only valid question–not whether it kill cancer cells in mice or in a petri dish.
Please read their very bold claims.
And then,
at the very bottom of the page,
you’ll find this almost unnoticeable,
very tiny,
disclaimer:
Image removed
Believe me, I want a natural cure as much as anyone. If my wife or loved one is diagnosed with cancer, I would like nothing more than to watch her drink juices and take herbs and watch the cancer melt away.
But I’m also a realist about this. I’m sure when Wendy was diagnosed, she searched as hard as anyone for evidence of a natural treatment to avoid surgery. I’m glad she didn’t wait for one–I much prefer her to be here among the living.
“Standing on my Head”––my chemo journal
T3a Grade 4 N+M0
RC at USC/Norris June 23, 2006 by Dr. John SteinBingo Pat and Karen, you are both right, I wish I had the diamond, the thing is Gene and I have been compared to the two by our friends, Gene looks alot like Elvis when thin, and I went to Catholic school from where he stole me, I to have and had dark hair etc. etc. so its pretty funny, but he did die on my birthday and was with GINGER. We saw Elvis in Cleveland , I was 9 months pregnant and didn’t think I would like him, as I was a more Beatle era, but Elvis was fabulous!!!!Long live the King!! Wheres my ring!!! Ginger
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